RetroFed
Spain must follow Poland's example to save Schengen: PM Tusk
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Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk has urged Spain to tighten border controls after tens of thousands of migrants entered the Spanish enclave of Ceuta, saying Madrid must follow Warsaw’s example “if Schengen is to survive.”
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Total shitshow: Ceuta is not part of Schengen. Ceuta has a border fence. The polish fence will also not hold when 50.000 people try to storm it. And Ceuta is in Africa and there is no way that those 50.000 people will be able to cross into Spain itself. And most of them have already left Ceuta. 50.000 is also a totally managable number for the EU. So fuck this guy?
Nothing but opportunists all across Europe (and especially in Italy). Instead of uniting against what is obviously an act of aggression by Morocco against Spain, they attack the Spanish government and exaggerate the situation with the aim of benefiting their respective parties at home (The Schengen area is not at stake, for those who don’t know geography, Ceuta is in Africa, it’s isolated. Heck! It isn’t even part of the Schengen area in the first place).
There are many things for which it is fair to criticize Sanchez, but this is not one of them.
I believe the danger they see is that these people are now allowed to ask for asylum, and while waiting on that the decision are free to roam Spain. Since there are no internal border checks, they can basically travel all around the Schengen area and ask for another asylum in the next country. i’m not really sure of the exact rules, but them hanging around in Ceuta is not the danger they see.
How are they going to get to the mainland? I kinda doubt the government will ship them across.
Does spain not fingerprint them at the start of their application?
what is the spanish government doing in Africa?
Administrating Spain?
The spanish government is governing a part of spain that is in Africa and has been a part of Spain for 600 years.
Same thing USA is doing in Hawaii, Guam, Alaska……
What the hell even happened there? Morocco relaxed borders and immigrants flooded Ceuta? As far as I read 37k out of 61k went right back shortly after that as well. Some 60 also drowned.
But what were they even fleeing from? Were they paid to do this move and took the opportunity out of desperation?
It all seems weird as hell.
Not only “relaxed”. It gave quite a helping hand apparently.
https://x.com/TalebSahara/status/2082930831903830429
What the fuck.
All the while Trump aparently said that this is due to the extreme far left..
Bruh.
The speed at what the Italian fascist responded closing the fucking schengen border really seems…coordinated. But what do I know.
Fascism causes problems and claims they’re solving them, while capitalism causes fascism. But out of the ashes of capitalism, we shall rebuild liberated socialism and communism - by council and by the commoner!
Morocco shipped trucks full of “immigrants” to the due to “special circumstances” relaxed border, soon after Israel threatened Spain with immigrant waves. Most of the “immigrants”, with no luggage, walked back after.
Not fleeing per se, just wanting better opportunities. Some of them might be unemployed and desperate, but most likely none of them had guns to their heads if that’s what you’re asking.
Not a literal gun perhaps, but as you said, they’re desperate, so a metaphorical gun is certainly to their heads.
message for everyone: immigrants aren’t cattle or numbers, they are people just like you
*To save Schengen from brown people. You forgot that part, Tusk.
Calm yourselves. Almost all of them have already left again.
And if they hadn’t, is not like they can walk to the peninsula. They are as close to Italy as they were before
Fucking right wing propaganda. Ceuta is in Africa and has no connection with the mainland, asshole. This should prompt a united response against Morocco, this constitutes an act of aggression. These right wing cunts are always looking for an opportunity to sow discord within the Union, its purely destructive.
There are some estimates we’ll see something like 1.5 billion climate refugees until 2050, but that might be overblown and globally. But still the numbers will explode for Europe until the rest of the century.
Unlike the USA, many EU countries have much higher population density. It would be hard to physically absorb such scales. And there certainly won’t be a political will by the people to accommodate as many as possible. I’d love an effort to build ultra high density metropolis’s for some kind of post scarcity living for millions, but that seems unlikely. And an unwillingness to address this makes the rise of fascist parties in Europe pretty much inevitable.
As long as there is prosperity and a positive outlook for the future, populations are generally quite fine with things, but that is not the case any more. We have something like 6% Muslim population (only a quarter practicing though) and millions of Ukrainian refugees in the EU. For most people this is already too much.
Ultimately climate change means genocide and we haven’t really done shit. These refugees are only the first waves.
There will never be post scarcity. AI will take any available resources. If you want such a structure, you can start building now.
Would you try to influence culture or would you accept whatever raw market mechanisms create?
Well that is the most likely outcome, unless we get extremely lucky.
Because influencing culture requires power and we the 99% don’t have any. Mostly I’m interested in understanding why and what is going to happen. I’m like a /popcornCommunist
Once you understand you do have the power to influence.
Uno reverse card: If you believe that, you don’t understand enough yet.
You need political power, wealth (economic power) or influence (cult and followers) or military power to influence people. And then it becomes a question of power imbalance - billionaires and governments can vastly outspend our organizing efforts and have more powerful tools (= high IQ specialists) at their disposal. They developed strategies and technology to combat democratic organization over the past decades.
It’s a numbers game: 10 motivated, enlightened people empowered with the power of friendship will never beat 1000 professional dumbass soldiers. That is the big liberal lie.
The high IQ specialists understand that their money cannot shield their children and grandchildren from all the negative consequences. Some can be bought but most high IQ people are trapped with us.
Well that is also true. But we’re definitely in a situation where many of the smartest and most intelligent people work for the worst causes because it pays the most and everyone has been indoctrinated to be self serving and individualist. Or they think “I need to play the game to get more power, and then I’ll be able to do some good” lol.
This is also an interesting article why-some-of-the-smartest-people-can-be-so-very-stupid.
In any case the effects of the growing climate refugees is very predictable. Neoliberal “leftist” parties will push for more immigration while calling opposition fascism and there will be growth in actual fascist parties.
It seems whatever happens, the plutocrats win. US starts foreign wars, refugees increase support for right wing. Economy is being gutted for wealth transfers, more people vote right wing. Crime is on the rise because of poor socioeconomics, people vote for harsher prisons and less spending on wellfare and education. But never ever does the mainstream talk about how the influence of plutocrats actually makes it happen, because they are stupid.
Poland’s example? As in build a fence in the middle of forest, expel journalists and send army to illegally return asylum seekers to Belarus? The main problem I see is that people are swimming to Ceuta and putting a fence on water will be complicated. Not because it’s hard but because people will die. The second problem is that it’s not in a forest and you will not be able to expel the press from there so everyone will see people drowning. But don’t give up Tusk, keep thinking.